A Foster & Adoption Journey with Jamie Allen

Matt Darrah (00:01.56)

Hello and welcome to All Things Foster, a place for coffee, connection, and community. I'm Matt Darrah your host, and we've got Jamie Allen on here with us today. Thanks for coming.

Jamie Allen (00:13.415)

Thanks for having me.

Matt Darrah (00:15.274)

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to drive your business goals forward. To contact Bob Talley at RunBiz, my friend and fellow adoptive parent, who was on the podcast a few weeks ago, give him a call at 806-322-2937. And again, I say this just about every week. Our podcast sponsors are fantastic folks that I have done work with. And as I said, Bob was on the podcast.

a few weeks ago is just a great, great guy. So if you need IT support, just give him a holler. And welcome again to Jamie, our esteemed guest today. I'm excited to talk about you guys' story and hopefully provide some just hope and connection to families that are kind of considering fostering or that are in the journey.

Jamie Allen (02:07.792)

Thanks, thanks. I'm excited to be here, Matt. It has definitely been an interesting journey that we've had. So I'm excited to, we don't talk about, I don't talk about it often because it's just our life. It's just who we are and what the Lord has allowed us to do. talking about it is probably going to be good for me as well as hopefully we can touch someone else that may be going through some similar struggles that we are.

Matt Darrah (02:36.076)

And that's the thing. It's a place for coffee connection and community, right? Because we do better in community. I say that a lot here on the podcast. And we want to share stories of hope and struggles and encourage folks that are doing it, that are in the work, and maybe they're struggling, maybe they're needing some hope, and maybe they just need some connection with somebody else that has kind of a similar story, right?

Jamie Allen (02:55.515)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (03:02.873)

Yeah.

Yeah, hearing that there's other people out there, that's definitely something we have not had. We kind of went into our journey, of course, not knowing what twists and turns it was going to bring. And even since our adoption was finalized years ago, 11 years ago, we still...

Matt Darrah (03:21.774)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (03:31.088)

There's nobody really around us that fully understands kind of what we've been through and what we go through on a day-to-day basis. So, yeah.

Matt Darrah (03:35.042)

Right.

Matt Darrah (03:39.01)

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, I say this a lot. If you're not in it, you don't get it. And so, my hope with this podcast is to provide that connection to other folks that are in it, that are struggling, that are doing it, but also maybe shed some light on the reality of the situation that we face, right?

Jamie Allen (03:46.97)

Mm-mm.

Jamie Allen (03:58.577)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (04:02.15)

Sure. Yeah, exactly. Yep.

Matt Darrah (04:05.324)

So let's talk a little bit about, let's go back to the beginning. us a little bit about your family and where things started for you guys.

Jamie Allen (04:18.448)

Sure. So my husband and I are high school sweethearts. were actually in the same kindergarten class. Yes, so many, many years we have known each other. And shortly after I graduated and we had moved back to Amarillo,

Matt Darrah (04:26.144)

my gosh.

Jamie Allen (04:40.356)

We decided we wanted to start a family and it was not an easy process for us. so we were, the Lord blessed us with our oldest son.

with a little bit of medicinal help along the way, we were able to get there. He was a twin and we lost his twin halfway through our pregnancy. So that was a little challenging, but we were thankful for the one and we're thankful for the promise of heaven. We've since lost a few more babies and so we're thankful that we'll get to meet them one day.

Matt Darrah (04:55.224)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (05:00.934)

man.

Jamie Allen (05:14.96)

So fast forward to when our oldest, who is now 17, was two. I'd always said I never wanted two in diapers. So we got him potty trained and just prepared to build our family again. And we knew that there were gonna be some challenges. so we went straight to our doctor and said, you know, we're ready to try again. And...

Matt Darrah (05:23.512)

the

Jamie Allen (05:43.439)

Over the course of, it was probably 18 months or so, we did everything we could medicinally, went to specialists, went all the way up to IVF and stopped there. It was just kind of our personal stop and we just surrendered it to the Lord. And I remember it was a Sunday morning and I told my husband, I can't even go into the service. We just found out we weren't pregnant again. And we went and sat in the Sunday school room by ourselves and just cried and talked.

Matt Darrah (05:47.779)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (05:53.846)

And, right.

Jamie Allen (06:13.402)

to the Lord and really just surrendered it to him and said, however you want to build our family, if that's your will, we're willing to do that. at the time we had just begun working with youth at our church and I was asked to give a devotional to the young ladies in our youth department and there was no parameters, it was just give a devotional whatever the Lord has put on your heart.

So I spoke to them about waiting on the Lord and that waiting on the Lord is always going to be the perfect thing to do. And it was at that devotional that a young lady, she was 17 I believe at the time, she had been adopted.

Matt Darrah (06:42.52)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (06:58.246)

it had been maybe two months prior by a family in our church. So here she is six months away from her 18th birthday where she would have just aged out of the system that she's been in and out of her whole life. And this baby came in and adopted her. And she at the end of the devotion, I was asked.

Matt Darrah (07:00.642)

Mm. Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (07:10.486)

Right.

Jamie Allen (07:19.334)

I told them, can ask any questions of me, anything you want to know. I'm an open book. I'm here to love on you and help you grow spiritually and with your walk with the Lord. And she raised her hand immediately. And I had shared some of my testimony about why we were waiting on the Lord and how we were waiting on the Lord. She raised her hand and said, would you ever consider adoption? And yeah.

Matt Darrah (07:41.954)

wow.

Jamie Allen (07:44.675)

And my first reaction was no, no, because how could I ever love a child that's not born of me the way that I love my son who did come from my womb?

Matt Darrah (07:52.418)

Mm.

Matt Darrah (07:55.842)

Yeah. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (07:58.721)

And the Holy Spirit immediately pricked my heart and said, I gave you the love that you have for your son. That's not something you created. Love is of God. And so if I choose to bless you with adoption, I'll give you that love too. I'll give you that capability too. Yeah. And so I immediately, the Holy Spirit spoke through me at that point. And I said no.

Matt Darrah (08:06.936)

care.

Jamie Allen (08:28.166)

And then you could just see the wheels turning and my mom was there and my best friend was there and the Lord just began to speak through me and I was like, but you know, if the Lord chooses to give us a child through adoption, then he'll help me love that child. He'll give me love. I didn't create the love I have for my biological child. So I went home.

Matt Darrah (08:47.694)

Right.

Jamie Allen (08:51.974)

and cuddled up to my husband and cried and just said, I really feel like maybe we're being called to adopt. And he said, okay. so we.

Matt Darrah (09:00.718)

So this has not been any conversation before this.

Jamie Allen (09:05.318)

No, no. In fact, if there was a conversation about adoption, it was in the negative. Not, no, don't want to adopt. We're going to let the Lord grow our family. And just, no, I just was not interested in adoption. My heart was very, not, I wouldn't say closed off. just didn't, prior to that revelation from the Lord, did not understand how I could love a child that didn't come from me in what I thought was going to be the same way that I love a child that did come from me.

Matt Darrah (09:10.37)

Right.

Jamie Allen (09:34.939)

So we got on our knees immediately and prayed for our little girl. And we just kind of told the Lord, we're gonna pray for her mom. We're gonna pray for her. And we gave the Lord some specific requests and said, this is kind of how we'd like our journey to look.

We had long since picked out a name for our little girl. And we actually did that at 16 on our way home from church looking in the Bible and we'd named our children. And so we prayed for her by name. And two weeks later.

Matt Darrah (10:08.131)

Ha ha.

Right.

Jamie Allen (10:15.91)

We walked into church and there had been a young woman struggling and she had three children. She had a little girl and twin boys and we walked in and I had actually helped her.

I wrote a grant to get her a car. We kept her at our daycare that we had at the time. We kept her kids so that she could go on job interviews. People from our church were taking her to job interviews. She had really been working hard to get her life together.

Matt Darrah (10:44.43)

Right.

Jamie Allen (10:46.192)

Well, I walked into church on a Wednesday night and there were two ladies standing there. One of them was holding, who is now our daughter, and the other one was holding these twin boys who were 14 months old. And it's like, what happened? And mom had severely slipped and had lost the children. So.

Matt Darrah (11:06.872)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (11:11.95)

They stayed with those families for a little while and immediately both of those families were like, we can't keep these children. So my husband and I prayed and it was like, well, maybe this is the Lord's will. So.

Matt Darrah (11:24.91)

You're hurt.

Jamie Allen (11:28.632)

We approached the family that had our daughter and said, you know, we would be interested in taking her and loving her and adopting her. And it was probably about six weeks later that through kinship, we got her for the first time. So she was about two years and seven months when she came to us the first time.

Matt Darrah (11:42.84)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (11:57.527)

So, and at that point,

We had her, she just kind of fit. She's about 22 months younger than our son. And what was funny is I'd always had this goal of I wanted my career and I wanted to be done with kids by the time I was 30 and I wanted all these things. And here I was 30 and not able to get pregnant again. And the Lord said, no, maybe you were done with kids by the time you were 30. You just didn't know it. You didn't know who I was gonna provide.

Matt Darrah (12:10.136)

Mm.

Matt Darrah (12:19.31)

Thank you.

Matt Darrah (12:24.846)

Right.

Jamie Allen (12:33.116)

and how I was going to provide. So we had her for about three weeks short of six months, which is the time that we were going to be able to file for custody. Yes, and through a series of very unfortunate events, we lost her. And it was incredibly unexpected.

Matt Darrah (12:34.595)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (12:46.852)

Yeah, doing an intervention. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (13:01.89)

It came during one of her supervised visits that she had. And a poignant part of our story, her story, is that she, our daughter, has two older siblings who had already been taken. And so her biological mom knew kind of the system and knew the program.

Matt Darrah (13:29.464)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (13:31.495)

and she knew what to do to get her taken away from us. So we lost her. We didn't get to say goodbye. They took her and it was done. And it was horrific. remember.

Matt Darrah (13:47.47)

Wow.

Matt Darrah (13:53.806)

And yeah.

Jamie Allen (13:54.627)

I remember bagging up her stuff and it is exactly like you see. I didn't have a suitcase for her. There was no reason for me to have a suitcase for her. She wasn't going anywhere because her biological mom was not making any steps really.

Matt Darrah (14:02.242)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (14:06.358)

Right. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (14:12.739)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (14:13.254)

to get her back. There was no desire there. She wasn't working the system. She wasn't working through the steps that she needed to get our children back. She just didn't want us to have her. Because she was calling us mommy and daddy just like our son was. I mean, we're not gonna stop her from doing that. And so over the next, goodness.

Matt Darrah (14:16.642)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (14:26.047)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (14:31.756)

Right. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (14:41.232)

probably 16 months, I guess. She went to another foster family and was not thriving at all. She was very much going downhill, losing weight, not eating. And I knew this. She was, she had just turned three. We lost her about five weeks after her third birthday. So...

Matt Darrah (14:48.856)

Yeah, right. Yeah.

And she was how old about this time?

Okay.

Matt Darrah (15:04.386)

No.

Jamie Allen (15:08.398)

We knew she wasn't thriving because my best friend actually had gone and gotten the boys. She and her husband had never been able to conceive and they lived four houses down from us and the boys actually attended daycare with our daughter with us and so they were able to be together every day. So they rip her out of all of this. Yeah, and put her in a family and she was not thriving at all.

Matt Darrah (15:20.462)

Mm.

Matt Darrah (15:26.894)

you

Matt Darrah (15:31.884)

All of that, yeah.

Jamie Allen (15:37.959)

And then there was a lady that I worked with, dear, dear, dear friend of mine that I worked with. And she and her husband had had on their hearts adoption for a long time. So it was shared with me at lunch one day that Marie was not doing well. And I go back to work and share it.

with a sweet lady that I worked with and she said, well, my husband and I have been considering adoption. And I said, go get her, go get her. And they did. And so I really felt like that was the Lord telling me, okay, there was a reason you were involved. You had to get her from point A to point B. So my husband and I just kind of took a deep breath, knew she was with a great family.

Matt Darrah (16:13.259)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (16:16.568)

Mm.

Matt Darrah (16:22.765)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (16:32.046)

And we're thankful that we have gotten to be a part of her story. We were excited to be able to be involved and see her grow and at least take solace in the knowledge that she was going to be well cared for and loved. Well, about five months later, they'd had her and wonderful Christian couple with two great kids. And she came in and closed my office door one day and just.

Matt Darrah (16:36.526)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (16:39.918)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (16:45.24)

Right. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (17:00.516)

broke down and said, we are not called to adopt her. And I just kind of looked at her for a minute, like, what do you mean? And she said, the Lord's making it really clear. She is not supposed to stay with us. So more tears.

Matt Darrah (17:11.79)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (17:18.208)

And we had a wonderful boss and so I went and shared with him kind of what was going on and he said, go home, figure it out. So I called my husband and we went home and we, but by that point she had moved from the kinship program into the full foster care system.

Matt Darrah (17:34.318)

Sure, right, yeah.

Jamie Allen (17:35.819)

So we, and through this process, we had been investigated and cleared of everything. It didn't take them, I think three days to do their investigation. And they were like, no, we don't have any issues. But by that point, we'd had attorneys tell us this bio mom's gonna come after you. She's gonna keep going.

Matt Darrah (17:49.518)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (18:00.506)

And just a reminder, this is the woman that you had written the grant for to get the car and do all the things. OK. OK. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (18:07.054)

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is, so there was a, there was an element of how could you do this to me after us taking care of your children, physically taking care of your children and me writing a grant to get you a car and us taking you to job interviews and like fall off the wagon. Fine. But then to turn around and throw it back in my face was just, that is something I still have to pray through.

Matt Darrah (18:22.594)

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (18:36.47)

I get it. I do. Sir.

Jamie Allen (18:36.6)

I still have to pray through those emotions for sure. So we approached CPS about becoming foster parents and getting our license. And I told them from the outset, this is why we're doing this. We're coming for her. We want to get her back. The family that she is with is not going to adopt her.

Matt Darrah (18:57.23)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (19:06.072)

And we were very, very straightforward from the beginning because I wanted them to know, I wanted the people who were training us and going through the training with us and certifying us to know the backstory. They needed to be able to connect the dots on their end of what we'd already been through. They needed to understand that she still had a room at our house that was decorated the exact same as the day we lost her.

Matt Darrah (19:14.67)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yep. All right.

Jamie Allen (19:29.518)

And so we just wanted everything out on the table. I thought that that was just going to be the best way. So we go through this weeks long process of getting your license. We go to class with the flu. Because you don't want to miss a class. You miss a class. You got to go back and repeat that class. And who knows how long that's going to take. Yes, exactly. Just get it done.

Matt Darrah (19:41.016)

Hmm.

No? Yep. Yeah, you're trying to get through it as fast as I can. Yeah. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (19:52.281)

So we did, we got our home study done, we passed everything, everything was great, get our certification, get our license, everything's done. And we find out two weeks later that throughout this time, they'd obviously been trying to get mom's rights removed. And...

Matt Darrah (20:11.64)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (20:15.046)

So they'd gotten that accomplished, which was kind of a non-starter for us. If they did not do that, weren't, mom had to be out of the picture for us to step back in. We had to know that we were protected and safe and that she was cared for and my husband and my son were protected. And we found out two weeks after we got our license that they were placing her with another family.

Matt Darrah (20:21.676)

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (20:29.838)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (20:41.776)

So it was like, you've got to be, and this is because she's with this woman who is, I work with, and she's telling me everything that's going on on their end so we can hopefully coordinate everything. And so I was like, you've got to be kidding me.

Matt Darrah (20:51.392)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (20:56.514)

Yeah

Jamie Allen (20:59.062)

So we called CPS and I said, close our license. I'm not playing your game. I'm not doing this. I'm not gonna get jacked around. I'm not gonna jerk her around. If you're placing her with another family that you think is better, that's fine. But I told you from the beginning, this is what we're doing. So my husband said, you know if we close our license, you know what that means. said, yeah, I do. But I just can't, I cannot subject myself.

Matt Darrah (21:08.578)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (21:28.742)

We can't subject our son to being jerked around because at this point he was almost five. We just can't go through the emotional turmoil. And so I called our caseworker and I said, close our license. I told you what we were doing. You guys went in a different direction. That's fine. She said, if you close your license, you're not getting any placements. I said, I know. I told you I was coming for her. Like that's I was doing. So two weeks later after that,

Matt Darrah (21:31.15)

Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (21:51.98)

Right. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (21:58.715)

We got a phone call and they said, we'd like to meet with you in our office. Okay, and so I called my friend that was still loving on our daughter and I said, hey, what's going on? She said, I have no idea. We're doing visitation with this other family. She's gone and spent time with them. They've come here. I don't know.

Matt Darrah (22:18.19)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (22:19.236)

So we go sit in the CPS office and it was my husband and I and my parents. My parents both went. And I sat down and admittedly was a little adversarial with them. And I got my phone out and I put my phone down in front of them and I said, I'm recording this meeting just so you know. And they said, well, if there's a trust issue, then we need to work through that. And I said, here's the deal. You have vetted me. I've gone through all the classes.

Matt Darrah (22:29.056)

I can imagine.

Jamie Allen (22:45.86)

I've had my home study done. You've searched my medicine cabinet. I've got locks on everything. I have been approved. So you don't get to vet me anymore. I have gone through all the questioning that I'm going to.

Matt Darrah (22:57.783)

Hmm.

Jamie Allen (23:02.914)

And I said, my issue is with you. I don't trust you. All of this stemmed, all of it stemmed from a 20 minute supervised visitation where my daughter was not supervised with her biological mom. She was allowed to be taken out of the room with her biological mom for over 10 minutes.

Matt Darrah (23:07.138)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (23:25.102)

wow.

Jamie Allen (23:25.72)

And then she came in, the mom came in and said, she said a series of words, which our daughter was not even speaking in complete sentences. She was barely three years old and was quite behind at the time.

Matt Darrah (23:38.605)

Yeah, sure.

Jamie Allen (23:40.109)

And so what she said, our daughter said, was just ridiculous. But that came because of an unsupervised time that she was supposed to have during supervised visitation. So there was no proof, there was no corroboration, nothing. So I just didn't trust them. And I said, no, this all stemmed from you guys breaking our trust. So through the course of that conversation, they said that the family, that they had...

Matt Darrah (23:58.103)

Mm-mm.

Jamie Allen (24:08.39)

placed Marie with did not feel as though they were called to adopt her. And which is beyond me because she was the sweetest, quietest, most beautiful three-year-old little girl. Well, she was four at that time. She turned four.

Matt Darrah (24:25.272)

Yeah, right, right.

Jamie Allen (24:29.378)

And I mean, she wasn't without her challenges, but she was a normal four year old. Yeah, she didn't have, she still doesn't have any behavioral issues. No outbursts, no anger, it's not who she is. So they said we would like to place her with you, but we need you to reopen your license. So it was like, you've gotta be kidding me.

Matt Darrah (24:32.898)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (24:38.722)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (24:48.812)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (24:53.463)

Right.

Jamie Allen (24:54.386)

So at that point, I put my foot down and I said, we will, but here's our conditions. I know you're gonna have to have visits with her. And I know there's multiple people that are gonna have visits with us, with her. You're gonna have to come in and do home checks. I know everything you're gonna have to do. You guys get together and however many of you have to come to our house once a month, y'all get together.

Matt Darrah (25:01.506)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (25:19.202)

you tell me what night you want to come, you're all going to come at one time, you're all going to be in and out within an hour, you're not going to disturb our family, and you're not going to disturb her anymore, she's been jerked around enough. And they did. They said okay.

Matt Darrah (25:24.856)

Mm-mm.

Matt Darrah (25:30.114)

Right. Yeah.

Wow. Were you licensed with CPS or did you have an agency? Okay. I see. Okay.

Jamie Allen (25:40.793)

No, we were straight through CBS. We went straight through CBS. So that first home visit, I got a call from our caseworker who was wonderful. And she said, there's three of us that are going to be coming. We need to come this night or this night. We're to be there at six o'clock. OK, fine. Great. We'll be here. They were in and out. It was great. They minimally spoke with her.

Matt Darrah (25:59.47)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (26:04.003)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (26:09.326)

And I think it's partly because I did somewhat put my foot down and say, you're not going to traumatize her any further. She doesn't know who to trust at this point. She had reactive attachments, so she would go to anyone. She would just go randomly hug people, but she had no idea who they were. And so we had to start teaching her boundaries immediately.

Matt Darrah (26:22.616)

Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (26:32.493)

Mm-hmm. So remind me, how many places has she been to at this point? know? Because she was obviously with my mom on the bike.

Jamie Allen (26:40.88)

So by the time she made it back to us, including her time with us, was six. So in less than two years, were six back and forths that she'd been to.

Matt Darrah (26:50.178)

Yeah, yeah, which research shows that each major transition like that is a six month behavioral developmental regression. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (27:01.954)

Yes, yes. So the three-year-old that we lost, I would say if we had been able to keep her, then a huge portion of the challenges that she has faced would not have been there. I just don't think they would have. I don't think they ever would have developed. So...

Matt Darrah (27:19.278)

Sure.

Jamie Allen (27:26.936)

We ended up hiring an attorney immediately and that was for no other reason than we wanted to push the process as quickly as we could. Our caseworker, her caseworker, our paperwork lady, you know, the one that came in and checked our medicine logs and all of that stuff, they were wonderful. They were great to work with. I think they had her best interest in mind at that point. But I think that's because she had someone stepping in for her.

Matt Darrah (27:43.246)

you

Matt Darrah (27:49.742)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (27:54.99)

exciting.

Jamie Allen (27:56.741)

saying, no, you're not going to do that or whatever. So it took us about, they told us it's going to be a year to year and a half process to get her actually adopted. she said, mom had, dad had not. Now,

Matt Darrah (28:05.356)

Hmm. Had she been terminated on by this point? Okay.

Jamie Allen (28:14.99)

We still don't have full confirmation of who bio father is. I have some suspicions, but it just doesn't matter. And so we had to terminate dad at that point and get dad's rights terminated. And so it took us, think we were, we had three months and then they said things are coming together pretty quickly. It looks like maybe by the end of the year and this was in.

Matt Darrah (28:19.502)

Yeah.

Yeah, I know.

Jamie Allen (28:44.506)

maybe June, May or June. And we went to our attorney and he said, I'm working on it, give me a little bit of time. They came to our house in August and said, we've got everything we need. So our adoption date was set in October.

Matt Darrah (29:07.182)

Right.

Jamie Allen (29:07.928)

So it was, it only took us about six months once we got her back to get the adoption there, to get adoption day done. So October 28th, she became ours finally. And I've always, always say that's the day that the state recognized that she was ours, that the Lord gave her to us before she was ever conceived. That's her story up until that point.

Matt Darrah (29:23.434)

Right. Yeah, sure. Wow.

Yeah. so, let's go back a little bit to the, you made a statement that I think is,

Matt Darrah (29:47.662)

It's kind of a misnomer, kind of a misunderstood thing that I think you can speak to. I know personally, Nikki even had some of the same kinds of thoughts, right? And so you said, before all this started, you were like, I don't think that...

I could love a child that didn't come from my womb the same way that I love a child that came from my womb, right? And where did that end up? Is there a difference?

Jamie Allen (30:20.198)

Yeah, exactly.

Jamie Allen (30:28.664)

Well, is there a difference in my love? Yes, there is a difference. We have since gone on to have the Lord blessed us with another biological child, surprisingly. And there is a difference between how I love all three of my children. It is not a matter of...

Matt Darrah (30:34.146)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (30:40.716)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (30:50.446)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (30:54.97)

their biological, she was adopted, which is what I thought. I thought it would be, I thought that would be the reason there was a difference. And it has taken me years to understand that the difference in my love is not due to how she came to our family. I think that the Lord gave us our youngest.

Matt Darrah (30:57.666)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (31:20.138)

and sandwich her in between to show me that I love my oldest differently than I love my youngest and they're both biological. Meaning my different love for her has nothing to do with how she came to me. It's just she's a different child and it's not an amount It's not an amount No. It's a kind.

Matt Darrah (31:29.366)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (31:40.908)

Yeah, yeah. And it's not an amount. It's not a measurement of an amount. It's just that it's different. mean, each kiddo is different in their unique ways. And you love this kiddo because they love doing things this way or whatever, and that kiddo, whatever. it's not an amount different. No.

Jamie Allen (31:51.279)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (31:59.431)

Negative. Not in any way. Is it an amount? No. In fact, I might say that it's a little bit... I don't want to say I love her more, but my heart wants to protect her. Feels the need to protect her more. I don't feel the need to protect my two biological boys. Part of it is that she's a girl. And...

Matt Darrah (32:12.515)

Hehehe.

Jamie Allen (32:29.334)

she's going to think about things differently and she's going to have questions. And so there's a biological need that God has given me to not shelter her but to protect her and to grow her. She's been through a nightmare. Yeah, she has. She has. Yeah, for sure. On the flip side of that,

Matt Darrah (32:42.956)

Mm-hmm. Right, because she's been through hell. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (32:54.406)

I have to be careful and I even have to caution my family, both my core family and my extended family. Do not treat her like she's a wounded bird. That is not gonna help her.

Matt Darrah (33:04.844)

Yeah. No.

Jamie Allen (33:07.714)

That's not going to teach her anything. That's not going to help her grow. That's not going help her learn. You treat her like you would treat any of your grandchildren, any of your nieces and nephews. She is the same. She needs to feel the same. She doesn't need to feel like she's different. And she doesn't...

Matt Darrah (33:16.206)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (33:22.402)

Yeah, it's part of normalcy.

just normal life. It's just, yeah. Can you hear me? Lost you for a sec. Yeah, it's part of that normalcy that folks talk about, right? They just need to feel normal.

Jamie Allen (33:28.007)

I lost you man. There you are. Yeah, there you are. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (33:36.516)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (33:41.792)

Yeah. So, so.

Jamie Allen (33:48.614)

I think I lost you, man.

Matt Darrah (33:49.794)

Can you hear me? Hello?

Jamie Allen (33:55.546)

Are you there?

Matt Darrah (33:56.364)

I'm here, can you hear me?

Matt Darrah (34:04.662)

No, no hear me?

Can you hear me?

Jamie Allen (34:10.394)

There you are. I lost you. Sorry.

Matt Darrah (34:11.896)

There we go. There we go. Okay, good. I can clean all that up, so don't worry about it. Yeah, yeah. Okay, good. Good. So...

Jamie Allen (34:15.558)

Are you there? Yes, there you are.

Jamie Allen (34:20.912)

Okay.

Matt Darrah (34:25.176)

So talk to us about the...

first time, know, there's a kind of a misnomer out there that, you know, I could never love them or let me rephrase.

Matt Darrah (34:46.54)

You know, they talk about how can you love them the way that you would love them if they don't stay, right? And then the trauma both to her and to your family with her leaving, right? I mean, dig into that for us a little bit. If it's not too painful.

Jamie Allen (35:06.192)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (35:12.294)

Sure. No. Well, even if it is painful, I think it's important. I think when the Lord gives you a desire to open your home up, whether it's just to foster or to foster to adopt, you have to open yourself up completely to that child.

Matt Darrah (35:33.038)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (35:39.171)

you don't get the option of withholding your heart because it's not, this child's circumstances are not their fault. They had no choice in the matter. They are the victims and I hesitate to use that word, but they are the victims in this situation. They are the ones who have been wronged. And so when she came into our home that first day, was, I had to love her completely.

I had to love her with every bit of my heart, even though, transparently, I didn't know how. It did not come completely naturally to me. My love for our son did not come completely naturally to me when I gave birth to him. I love my children, but it's not a...

Matt Darrah (36:23.874)

No. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (36:31.298)

It wasn't for me, I experienced some anxiety and things like that after I had our son. And so it was, that was a struggle for me. So I had to open myself up and then you just have to give it to the Lord. You just have to tell the Lord.

Matt Darrah (36:44.226)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (36:46.616)

Okay, you have put this out there. You've given our family this opportunity. You have blessed us with this child, so we're gonna love her. And you just have to do it. I mean, it's not, they have to feel like they are completely loved and completely accepted from the moment they step in your door, or you've lost them.

Matt Darrah (36:58.904)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (37:04.791)

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it just is. I this thought that you can, you know, and maybe some people can. I literally don't know anybody who can bring this kiddo into their home and like not love them completely regardless of what could happen. I mean, don't know how you do that.

I mean, and I'm sure that there are people out there that can and do. I've been in this world for so long, and I literally don't know anybody who just doesn't love them completely from the moment that they show up until the moment that they go home or become theirs. I mean, there's just this thought out there that they can't...

Jamie Allen (37:42.374)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (37:51.524)

rest.

Matt Darrah (38:01.28)

if you're fostering them and you know that they're going to go somewhere else or you don't know that they're going to go somewhere else, you just don't know that you can withhold some piece of yourself and not love them totally and completely and regardless of whatever happens and then be completely heartbroken when they go back into a scenario that you know is not good and beneficial.

And you have to heal from that because it is a trauma. It's a trauma to you, to your husband, to your son, to grandparents and everybody, right? I mean, it's a trauma to the child for sure, and then the rest.

Jamie Allen (38:35.417)

It is.

Matt Darrah (38:49.4)

But you can't just like not fully welcome them and embrace them into your home, into your heart. I don't know how you do that.

Jamie Allen (38:55.94)

No, no, no. And I think part of the blessing that I had was I had left a professional career and began working with my mom at our daycare where we had 95 kids. And so loving kids, that's the easy part of daycare.

Matt Darrah (39:14.434)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (39:18.488)

And we were a little bit of a different scenario. We wanted it to feel like grandma's house. And so every child got a hug, every child got an I love you, every child got a kiss on the forehead. You know, we wanted them to know that when they were there, they were loved, they were safe. It was a safe place for them because not all of them had that at home. Some of them would leave us every day and go home to a not so great situation.

Matt Darrah (39:37.326)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (39:47.15)

And so it was the same kind of thing. Kids just need, they just need and deserve love.

Matt Darrah (39:52.108)

Yeah, Yep. We have these coins. I haven't shown them to you, but we started, we got them made. They're these big challenge coins. I don't know that is. And so we put our logo on one side, but on the other side, it says, I am valuable and loved. And the hope is that these kiddos carry it around in their pocket. It's this big heavy coin and it's just some tangible thing that they can read and say, I am.

Jamie Allen (40:01.989)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (40:09.819)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (40:20.938)

valuable and loved. Because in this chaos of life, they don't feel that. And it takes a long time and a lot of work to hopefully overcome that.

Jamie Allen (40:22.192)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (40:29.798)

They don't.

Jamie Allen (40:39.034)

Yeah, and I don't know that we've, don't, we're 11 years in and I don't know that we've still breached that barrier. There are still walls in her heart, completely understandably so. And it's funny because for a long time I felt like she was different because she was adopted or any of the questions that we had were because she was adopted. And so I and I talked to my pastor and he's like,

Matt Darrah (40:43.566)

Good night.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (41:06.497)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (41:08.93)

I have seven biological children and all of them are different. She's just different than what you're used to. She's not your son. She's got a different personality. And it was at that moment that my husband and I realized she's just like my husband.

Matt Darrah (41:11.234)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (41:16.536)

Yeah. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (41:25.798)

quiet, she's reserved, she observes things, she wants to stick back a little bit before she puts herself out there and when the Lord revealed that to us it was like okay it's not that I'm doing something wrong it's not that there's anything that we need to fix it's just who she is. But by the same token we now have this beautiful teenage girl and

Matt Darrah (41:29.134)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (41:40.044)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (41:45.293)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (41:54.603)

She's getting into a phase of her life where she's starting to form relationships with friends. And she's recognizing that she's got challenges. One of her friends asked her about a year ago, man, you have trust issues, don't you? And she came home and shared that with me. And it was kind of a moment, because I've always known that. I know that she's got trust issues. She should have trust issues.

Matt Darrah (42:20.354)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (42:23.62)

But it was a moment for her to be able to understand, well, yeah, and it's because of what I've been through. And so she, at some point, she's gonna have to learn to rely on the Lord and she's gonna have to learn to heal and the Lord's gonna have to heal her. There's things I can't fix, there's hurts I can't fix.

Matt Darrah (42:31.598)

Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (42:39.555)

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, these are conversations we have all the time in our house, too. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (42:47.076)

Yeah, yeah, she's gonna have to do it on her own. There's things she has to work through and that's hard. It's a hard thing as a mom, for sure.

Matt Darrah (42:52.078)

Yeah. Because you want to heal them, you want to fix them, you want to help them get through it, but ultimately, I mean, and this is the conversations we have at home too, it's like, we can't fix it. You can't. You can't fix it on your own. You've got to rely on the Lord to heal you and help you let go and help you forgive.

Jamie Allen (43:15.386)

Yeah. Right. And surrender it and surrender it and surrender it over and over and over until you don't have to surrender it anymore. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (43:19.384)

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm almost 45 years old, and I came from a history of trauma and things, and I'm still working on it. I'm still surrendering it. I got this tattoo that says, by day, like, just every day, one foot in front of the other, working through stuff, trying to heal, trying to find forgiveness, trying to, you know, let the Lord have it. And it's hard.

Jamie Allen (43:33.637)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (43:37.679)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (43:48.933)

Yeah. Yeah, it is. It's very hard. And I have doubts about my abilities as a mother all the time. And there's the fear of, she wish she was put with another family? Does she, because we keep in touch with a couple of the families that had her before us, wonderful people. And does she wish she was still with them?

Matt Darrah (43:58.991)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (44:18.406)

you know, when she gets in trouble with us for whatever reason, does she hate me? she? And I don't worry about that with our biological children. Like, I don't care if they hate me. I'd rather deal with it. And that's how it should be with her. But oftentimes Satan puts questions in my heart and puts doubts in my heart about, about.

Matt Darrah (44:22.84)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (44:28.696)

Right.

Jamie Allen (44:44.748)

my abilities and the truth is I have to surrender that and say I'm not able to do any of this. I can't, I don't have the capability of raising them, raising any of them. I've got to give them to the Lord and trust that he will be sufficient. I don't have to be sufficient. He's sufficient to meet those needs.

Matt Darrah (45:04.814)

Yeah. Right. Yeah, we, I mean, we as parents want to fix and help and things and ultimately it does. We can't do it in and of ourselves. We could be the most perfect parent ever and they're still gonna have things that they have to work through. And like I said, it's the same for bio kids and for foster adoptive kids.

It's probably just a little maybe more pronounced or something with them. Because of their history, you see that the struggles are there and you want to fix it. So how are things now? You said it's been 11 years. There's still struggles, but overall.

Jamie Allen (45:37.819)

Right.

Jamie Allen (45:43.984)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (45:47.62)

Yeah. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (45:55.622)

Thank

Overall she is beautiful and happy and healthy She is learning to form good relationships She is guarded For sure in her relationships and it's I I can foresee it being a challenge to her to Find find a husband

I can see those things being a challenge for her. She said she doesn't want to be married. That she doesn't want kids. Now she's young. mean, she's got, she also said she wants to live in Paris. you know, who knows? But she's doing great. The only real challenges that she faces and that we face are

Matt Darrah (46:36.568)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (46:55.498)

I'm blessed that I get to homeschool my children. And so we've had some learning difficulties. It's not anything that anyone would be able to see, which almost makes it more difficult.

Matt Darrah (46:58.478)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (47:11.46)

But there's definitely some, she's been, we've had her tested as a little girl, no short term memory, none, which has been a huge challenge in school. I homeschooled our son and when it came time to do his multiplication facts, we turned it into a game and how fast can you do it and all of that. And with her that didn't work. And so I have learned so much about how to teach the child in the way that they learn.

Matt Darrah (47:21.688)

Yeah, yeah.

Matt Darrah (47:29.026)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (47:38.477)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (47:39.271)

And there's things that I don't make her do. She still has to do her spelling.

but I don't make her take spelling tests at the end of the week. That created a ton of anxiety for her when she was younger and she would study for hours and physically not capable of keeping those words in her brain. So, okay, fine, don't do that. Don't do your spelling test. Write your words. I want you to have access to it. I've taught her how to use a dictionary. She got to use her flashcards, her multiplication flashcards for three years because it took her that long as she's doing her math through the repetition.

Matt Darrah (47:50.763)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Matt Darrah (47:57.976)

Right.

Matt Darrah (48:05.805)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (48:11.906)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (48:15.566)

and now we're entering the driving phase and those challenges are appearing again. And it's how do you put your 15 year old behind the wheel of a car when they're understanding decision making and

Matt Darrah (48:24.503)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (48:37.676)

remembering everything you have to remember when you're driving a car, it's not there. And so we've had to kind of really slow down and it's just going to take a little longer. It's just going to take a little and so that's okay. Once we realize that and we accept that, then we know how we can go forward. Okay, it's just going to take a little longer. Let's just let's plod along. Her brain's going to have to form its own workarounds. I'm not always going to be there.

Matt Darrah (48:40.578)

Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (48:56.664)

Mm-mm.

Matt Darrah (49:06.51)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (49:06.95)

to fix the world for her. She's gonna have to figure out how to think through these things on her own. So, yeah.

Matt Darrah (49:11.79)

Wow. are you most proud of with your kids?

Jamie Allen (49:21.968)

Man.

Matt Darrah (49:23.182)

Ha ha ha.

Jamie Allen (49:26.182)

Our daughter has the most forgiving and intuitive heart of any child I've ever, I've ever encountered and I've encountered a lot. My mom's been in daycare since I was four. She is incredibly intuitive and can pick out pain that others may be feeling. She can pick out when people are being fake.

Matt Darrah (49:35.374)

you

Matt Darrah (49:40.108)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (49:50.702)

Right.

Jamie Allen (49:55.623)

and putting on a show, she can see pain that I can't see sometimes. And I have always, always said, our daughter is not adopted. It's a past tense. It's a past tense. She was adopted. It was a one-time thing. I was adopted into the family of Christ one time.

Matt Darrah (50:03.438)

you

Matt Darrah (50:15.438)

Yep. Yep.

Yep.

Jamie Allen (50:21.006)

into the body of Christ. It's not something you have to continually do. And so my sons don't look at her as their adopted sister. She's just their sister. And so I just, it's been cool to see the Lord weave their lives together. And the older, my older two have gotten, it's just neat to see them form their own relationship and their own bond.

Matt Darrah (50:33.514)

Exactly.

Matt Darrah (50:42.158)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (50:50.502)

for sure. So, yeah.

Matt Darrah (50:54.126)

So if you were going to talk to somebody, or I'm sure you probably have the conversations, what you talk to somebody that's saying, maybe I should foster, maybe I should adopt. What does it look like? How do you love those kids with them if they might go home or whatever? What does that conversation look like with you?

Jamie Allen (51:13.51)

.

Jamie Allen (51:20.612)

believe in honesty. I think that people need to know the pitfalls of the process. I think they need to know that they're going to be working into a broken system. When we are called to love the widows and the orphans in the Bible,

that anytime that a government steps into that, there's going to be pitfalls. It's not gonna be a straight road. It's not gonna be as easy as, you can't take care of your child, I will. But if the Lord is truly calling them to do that, then you go all in. Keep your eyes open. Know that you have to be your own advocate.

Matt Darrah (51:57.454)

Hmm.

Matt Darrah (52:06.926)

Mm.

Jamie Allen (52:13.85)

and you have to be that child's advocate for no matter how long it is that you have with them. You have to be their biggest advocate, their strongest advocate while they are in your home. If you're not willing to do that and you're not willing to have hard conversations and you're not willing to fight for them, then don't do it. But if you understand

Matt Darrah (52:25.038)

you

Jamie Allen (52:42.436)

and can't fully understand, if you know that you're working in a broken system and that there's going to be pitfalls and there's going to be struggles and there's going to be heartache and the Lord's calling you to that, then you get behind Him and you trust that He's going to carry you because for that 18-month period I had it posed to me this way.

The Lord's weaving a quilt, he's quilting. And when you look at the underside of a quilt that's not yet finished, there's string and there's yarn and there's all sorts of things under this quilt. And sometimes that's all you can see. so for a long time, we just sat under a quilt and it was patchwork and it was not finished and there were strings hanging out and it was hard. And one day the Lord will flip over that quilt and you're gonna get to see this beautiful masterpiecce

Matt Darrah (53:17.016)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (53:23.566)

Hmm.

Jamie Allen (53:36.345)

masterpiece that he's been working on. So there is another side to it. Sometimes the quilt gets flipped back and you go back to the ugly. But that's with any child, biological or not. There's ugly, there's tough, there's hard. Regardless of how a child comes into your family, there's ugly and there's hard. But are they worth it?

Matt Darrah (53:37.258)

I love that.

Matt Darrah (53:50.36)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (54:03.352)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (54:03.556)

Are they worth it? Is their life worth it? Is their soul worth it? And that's what I would say.

Matt Darrah (54:06.434)

Yeah. I love it. What are some of the things that either you wish you had had during the process or things that you did have that were just so helpful and encouraging? Talk to us about outside support mechanisms for your family that either you wished you had or that you did have that were awesome.

Jamie Allen (54:28.646)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (54:34.086)

You know, I was very hesitant in the beginning to be a part of maybe like the GAFPA organization because I wanted my little girl and I wanted to go back to my little hole and forget that there was a time in my life that I didn't have her. So being a part of those organizations...

Matt Darrah (54:50.135)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (54:59.108)

was just not a desire that I had, not that they're not great, not that they're not great people, they are with good hearts. I just wanted to grab her back up and hold her and shut the world out. A network though of people that I can talk to who are facing the same struggles that I am.

Matt Darrah (55:01.198)

Yeah. Yeah. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Matt Darrah (55:11.854)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (55:22.874)

would have been hugely helpful. It's our own fault that we did not get involved in those things. It really is. They were available. I just didn't take advantage of them because I, A, it was probably arrogance, pride. I thought I was equal to the task and I don't need anybody, know, whatever. But if I could be that voice for someone else,

Matt Darrah (55:29.25)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yep.

Matt Darrah (55:39.936)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (55:47.941)

that may have a similar story, doesn't even have to be the same story. Maybe they got a child from a younger age and have kept them the whole time, but they're seeing some of the same struggles that we have. Now I wanna be that for someone else. But it's a lifelong thing. It's gonna be a lifelong challenge.

Matt Darrah (55:59.087)

Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (56:05.602)

Hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (56:11.736)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (56:12.218)

For sure. So a network definitely of knowing. think podcasts, they weren't podcasts, a thing 11 years ago, not really. If I could go and listen to podcasts when I had her as a five-year-old, a four-year-old, and I was seeing things that I knew didn't add up, but I didn't really know how to talk about it or who to talk to, I think these are great, great things for sure. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (56:18.174)

Yeah, yeah.

Matt Darrah (56:33.794)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, that's awesome.

Well, Jamie, listen, I I just really, really appreciate just is a hard it's a hard thing. Right. And I want this podcast to be real. And I don't I don't want it to just be all roses and butterflies. Right. Because that's not the reality. It's not. Right. I want to have good, positive, encouraging stories, but I also want it there to be.

Jamie Allen (56:51.856)

Mm-hmm.

Jamie Allen (56:55.96)

Yeah, yeah, that's not, and it's setting people up for failure.

Jamie Allen (57:05.743)

Yeah!

Matt Darrah (57:08.598)

truth and reality, and it's not all great and wonderful. There are great and wonderful things, and everybody has a different experience, but I will tell you that your experience is not unique. I had some neighbors down the street with a similar type story at my old house, but they had gotten involved in fostering, and they had this little girl, and

Jamie Allen (57:19.045)

Yes.

Jamie Allen (57:24.165)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (57:38.016)

And then something similar type thing happened with CPS. Somebody got upset and removed her. They fought and fought, spent a mountain of money, got her back, and then now they have her. And they've had her for a long time, and she's doing well and all the things. But that's, I mean, I want this to be real conversation about real situations that are, that, you know.

Jamie Allen (57:47.525)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (57:54.555)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (58:07.072)

other people can listen to and say, I hear the struggle. I hear the pain. But there's also a lot of hope in your story, too. It's not that it's all awful and terrible and, my God, don't do this.

Jamie Allen (58:12.587)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah, a ton. No. No, not at all, because I think the fact that we did have to fight, I tell her all the time, I didn't have to fight for your brothers.

The Lord gave them to me in a very easy way. I didn't have to fight for them. I chose to fight for you. The Lord wanted us to fight for you. You were fought for from the very beginning. And so I think...

We have the ability to share with her that we so loved her that we did fight for her. And you know, there's a lot of her story that she doesn't know that she's not emotionally mature enough to know. There's a lot of it I have shared with her. And we have our best conversations in the car, it seems, where she's sitting back there and we just chat. It's not threatening at all to her in that time. But the fact that she knows we did fight

Matt Darrah (59:01.656)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (59:17.864)

for her, I think can be almost a positive for her to know that we loved her enough to fight for her. Yeah, for sure. And there's a ton of positive. When we were blessed enough to get pregnant with our third, we had a girl's name and a boy's name and did the whole thing. And the minute that I found out we were having a boy, I was so thankful.

Matt Darrah (59:23.16)

Yeah. Yeah.

Right. Yeah.

Jamie Allen (59:46.599)

because I wanted her to have something that was unique to her. If we had had a daughter, I am afraid she might have compared herself. And so I'm so thankful she's that special and we pray for our little blonde haired blue eyed little girl. And then we got her.

Matt Darrah (59:57.656)

sure.

Matt Darrah (01:00:04.464)

Yeah.

Jamie Allen (01:00:07.174)

So and it's probably if well she was getting her her permit a couple months ago took her permit permit and I had to get my driver's license renewed at the same time and We took our pictures and the lady that was sitting the DPS lady said

y'all look just alike. You do the same thing as your mom does and she just kind of looked at me and I winked at her because it's kind of like our special little little secret and it's cool just because you can see how the Lord has just knit her so perfectly. So yeah, it's a neat story for sure.

Matt Darrah (01:00:34.028)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (01:00:39.8)

Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, there's heartache and there's struggle, but there's hope. There's hope. Yeah. Yeah. And she is 100 % worth it. Right? Man, such good stuff. Thanks again so stinking much for coming and sharing and being real and open and honest and vulnerable, know, just vulnerable. And so I do want to take a minute.

Jamie Allen (01:00:45.83)

Yeah, absolutely. 100 % worth it. Yeah.

100%. Yep, absolutely.

Jamie Allen (01:00:59.344)

Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Darrah (01:01:09.826)

to remind you guys RunBiz, great, great company, great, friends. And we've done, I think, 52 placement packages this year so far, which is fantastic. Each placement package costs us about $430. And so we are, hopefully you guys have seen that we lost some funding, some federal funding about a month ago.

Jamie Allen (01:01:22.852)

Right.

Matt Darrah (01:01:37.434)

and but God us good, He's faithful, and so we're just asking folks to be placement package partners. You know, hundred bucks a month buys us all the clothes that we need for one placement package. Fifty bucks pays for a case of diapers. know, ten dollars a month pays for one outfit for a placement package. And so, you know, if the Lord puts it on your heart, go to our website, panhandleorphan.org / donate.

That just continues to help do the placement packages, which are so precious and valuable. I took one to a grandma on Wednesday. She's 70 years old, and actually not grandma, great grandma, who her and her husband took in their nine-month-old great-grandson. Yeah, at 70.

Jamie Allen (01:02:27.526)

you

Jamie Allen (01:02:31.021)

my word. cannot imagine.

Matt Darrah (01:02:32.94)

and they needed a crib and some sheets and stuff and things like that. I mean, I love the placement package. It really speaks to the value of the children and encouragement to the families. And so, you know, we do, we need folks to become those placement package partners. So guys, like, share, subscribe, all the things, more and more people. We want folks to hear these stories.

Jamie Allen (01:02:40.784)

Yeah.

Matt Darrah (01:03:02.04)

to hear the reality. And so please like, share, and subscribe. again, Jamie, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and just being real and being honest.

Jamie Allen (01:03:15.736)

It was a blessing. I'm thankful that I got to get it out there for the first time in a long time. So I hope it's an encouragement. I hope people see the Lord in these situations. I hope the Lord shows himself mighty to love these sweet babies.

Matt Darrah (01:03:19.726)

Again, that's good.

Matt Darrah (01:03:27.43)

Yeah, do too. do. Yeah, Fran, yeah, it's so, and he is, he is behind these, you know, he is the father to the fatherless, right? And so, yeah. So next week, guys, we're gonna kick off a five-part series with a woman that is, she's got her master's degree, she's working on her,

doctorate degree and we're going to talk about trauma. It's going to be kind of a hard and intense series, but there's hope at the end of it. there's hope weaved throughout it, but we're going to have some real conversation about trauma because it's part of what we're doing. And so I hope you'll tune in to those episodes. Go back and listen to some of the previous episodes. We've got some really good resources that are out there. We've got some great stories.

Thanks again and we'll see you next week.

Matt Darrah (01:04:29.304)

Thank you, lady.

Jamie Allen (01:04:30.598)

Absolutely, was a blessing. Thanks for letting me.

Matt Darrah (01:04:32.266)

Yeah, so good. All right, well, I will get this edited. And once I get it edited, I'll send a link to you. You can look it over. And if there's something I need to take out or whatever, just let me know. All right? Thanks, lady. Bye.

Jamie Allen (01:04:46.872)

Okay, sounds good. Thanks, Matt.